LB,

- RoR (Ring of Rail) map, from LB's imagination: This is a very nice map! A picture is worth a thousand words. Some time ago, I wrote to either the PM or Queen's Park (don't recall which one, may be both) talking about transportation corridor with a similar map, but my map was not as pretty as yours, since I just drew in straight lines to illustrate the point. Anyhow, PMO and/or Premier Wynne forwarded copies to the responsible Ministers (it was Tony Clement who was responsible for the RoF before it was passed along to Greg Rickford...I think, I don't keep track of the past, it should be in the computer somewhere).

This is a comprehensive map and would be a good tool to show decision makers what are involved in this grand scheme. The connecting road network, as shown in the KWG map (alternate EW road), should be shown along this RoR map for completeness.

Perhaps, this could be sent to both PMO/Rickford and Queen's Park/Gravelle with a 1 page (max 2 page) write up to discuss the pros and cons. Below are some cons.

- The portion proposed by TGR and supported by G Chief Martin has some merit in the grand scheme of thing, but this would take a lot longer and more costly to build compared to the NS RR on the esker corridor proposed by KWG. Many posters have discussed this point before: the soggy spongy swamp compared to a lot more solid footing provided by the esker. One poster has indicated that RR can be built on a bog, just like ice road built on a lake, but this is for light trains, not heavy trains for transporting heavy bulky stuff. Besides, just like running on an ice road over a lake, one would need to keep an eye on the speed (wave generation underneath the ice road) and transition from lake to shore and vice versa. There are many pictures on the web showing transport rigs sinking in the lake. Example of train sinking could be seen on one of the episode of "Hell on Wheels". one of the requirement for "ice bridge" is that the load must be moving along, if the load is stuck in one spot, the local presure would be too much for the rail on ice (and/or on bog) to support the weight. Watch the wheels of that train (on TV) spinning, spinning and spinning, creating a nice sagging portion for the train to go down slowly. It's eye opening (for the train boss as well). Based on this alone I would say this is an expensive proposition, or perhaps TGR and the Chief have not consult the experts on this (they could have checked with Deloitte, lol!)

Another thing, the TNR Release says: "TGR Rail Canada is proud to confirm that it is moving forward with a proposal to negotiate a deal to finance build and operate a 410 km railway to the Ring of Fire from Moosonee on James Bay with the Mushkegowuk Council". A quick check of the map (provide by LB) seems to indicate that the lenth of the line from the RoF to Moosonee (purple line + orange line) is around 525km rather than 410km as stated in the release. If so, they are off by about 100km in their estimate, plus the fact that they are in soggy terrain. The estimate of the 300km NS RR from Nakina to the RoF was ~$1.5B (compared to ~$1.2B for the CLF proposed private road). So, the cost for the purple and orange lines proposed by TNR would be expected to cost, say 1.5 x 525/300 = more than $2.6B. If the bog factor is taken into account then the cost of this rail proposal would be about double the NS RR on the esker corridor proposed by KWG. As I have indicated. where they are going to get the aggregates for the rail bed? In summary somebody has not even done a rough estimate of the cost. But according to Dancey "TNR has the funds required to do whatever is required". This is a bold statement. In my opinion, it would be more believable to provide the detail. If they can't back it up with the detail then the proposal is simply not credible. For this I am taking the "show me the money" attitude.

goldhunter.