I do agree with all you have stated on the China factor in the 'World Markets' though deciphering how, what, and when they make their way there is beyond me, for the most part. As for the Short Term Trading Pattern, I got it well figured out in mid November for the remainder of 2007 but need to see some interaction over the next little while before working on patterns for the next 3-4 months, both for the 'Big Picture/Theme' stuff and for Noront and the 'Ring of Fire' side plays. By the time I can say I see what it will be it will be so close to being ready for the next phase of the short term cycle that it will not be of great benefit to me personally, but it helps with keeping a steady focus in tact and thus is worth the effort. I do not was TA in discerning patterns as I have just passing knowledge on TA Basics and have noted repeatedly that even the best of the TA readers are usually only close and constantly revising their outlook. There is enough to keep me busy without trying to compete with these better (though always approximate and tentative) TA Folk. With all that said, and taken with some part of the Salt Grain in mind, I do believe we have a constant 'manipulator factor' to keep in mind. They will work together so long as they do at least a little better than pay their bills and meet their masters desires. But I wonder how much cohesion they have planed into the reaction/action that may be sudden, when a currently passive Big Player (with the packets ready and willing to empty) decides it is time to step into the trading game in a significant way. Will the manipulators act/react independent of one another when their 'Algorithms' show a rapid change in trading? Will they attempt to regroup or will that indicate that it is time to go to 'every one for themselves' again for what ever the time frame for the next big run up in SP. Just for the fun of it all I liken it to a 'Pirates of the Caribbean' fudge factor these types have to deal with in their style/type of business model. Old Joe PS: Anything big or small that help us gain some type of insight into the peculiar workings of the Market Place can only be helpful. Hoping I am, in my small way, contributing.