"How do you get them out? I don't know.. but pressure from retail may be the only way.. pie in the sky? perhaps.. but I refuse to sit and do nothing and just hope... I've done that for too long.."

So continue to make empty noise - the same noise that has been made for all the time you speak of. Maybe yell louder - ya, that'll work! Oh wait, maybe it won't - it never has before.

So you refuse to sit, do nothing, and hope. You can help Ease with his homework assignment. Your constant complaining about something that virtually everyone agrees is not a "happy thing" ain't doin' the trick - and it never will.

In my working life, I virtually never approached management with a problem without offering at least a couple of alternative solutions.

You guys keep screaming "Problem, Problem", and your solution is to constantly gripe about it on a message board.

How productive.

JMHO,

SGE